Assembling my (DuoSonicII's) rig - suggestions?

DuoSonicII · #1 06.14.05, 12:41 AM

OK, I've always used pedals, but I'd always just set them up one-by-one on an as-needed basis. However, I've always wanted to have a more permanent setup. I've spent a lot of time reading GuitarGeek the past few months, and I feel like I've learned a lot. The next step (which I'm in the process of) is to lay out the necessary cash to get the rest of the stuff I need for my ideal board. I am then planning on building my own pedalboard and finally assembling my "rig" in at least a semi-permanent fashion.

I have an overall plan, or at least an idea in my head of how the setup should go. In general, I plan to use a true-bypass Loooper with just one loop, and put the less-frequently used pedals in the loop. So here's an equipment list:

In the main chain:
Tuner - Boss TU-2
Volume - Ernie Ball full-size mono volume pedal
Wah - Vox V848 (coming soon courtesy of eBay)
Overdrive - Fulltone Full-Drive 2
Distortion - Marshall Shredmaster (on the way from Geetar_Will)
Delay - Boss DD-20 (still tracking one down, also for a basic looper for practice)

In the loop:
Pitchshift - Digitech Whammy reissue
Phase - E-H Small Stone (newer true bypass)
Tremolo - Boss TR-2
Rotary/Vibe - Dano Chicken Salad and/or Rocky Road (still experimenting with both)
I might also throw in a second delay (Dano PB & J) or another fuzz/distortion pedal (E-H Big Muff USA, ProCo Rat 2) - all of these pedals are currently waiting in the wings.

And I'm trying to find a decent deal on a Voodoo Labs Pedal Power 2+ to power it all.

Overall, I want to have volume up front (to use it just like the guitar's volume knob), followed by wah, overdrive, distortion, the Loooper (and aforementioned pedals in the loop), and of course delay last. A couple of things make me unsure of what to do with the tuner pedal: I've heard that it is good practice to start and end your chain with buffered bypass pedals (in this case the TU-2 and the DD-20), and I've also heard that you can have some tonal issues if you put the volume pedal first in the chain due to putting the resistances of the guitar volume pot and the volume pedal pot in series. Both of those things make me want to put the tuner first in the chain, but using the tuner out of my volume pedal for the tuner also seems to make sense. I could use some advice on that one.
A second bone of contention is the placement of the Whammy pedal. I know it's good practice to put it early in the chain, but I really want to put it in the bypass loop due to its tone-sucking reputation and crappy bypass. If I put it first in the bypass loop (after the tuner, volume, wah, OD, and distortion), am I still asking for trouble? My personal experience has been that overdrive may actually help it some by strengthening the signal, but the wah and Shredmaster concern me. I suppose that experimentation is the only real way to know - I'll give it a shot once my Vox Clyde and Shredmaster get here. My plan is to get a FoxRox Octron whenever Mr. Fox decides to make them more widely available, they are true-bypass with adjustable volume control for octave up signal, octave down signal, and the original signal - perfect for my needs.

OK, this is getting really long, so I'll wrap it up. I'll mainly be using my G&L ASAT (Tele), CIJ Fender Jazzmaster, and '65 Fender Duo-Sonic II with this setup, and everything will run through my Fender '65 Deluxe Reverb reissue. The Deluxe Reverb will supply the more "normal-sounding" trems and, of course, reverb (The TR-2 will be used for helicopter-ish choppy sounds).

I appreciate any and all comments and advice, much love to the GG community.

Jelly · #2 06.14.05, 4:21 AM

Hey man,

Looks good to me...only a few comments/questions-

Whereabouts in the chain is the loooper going to go? You would probably do best to have it near the start if you want the whammy in it...but as you say, you will need to experiment to see where it can track well enough.

I would (personaly) go for one of the more complex looopers, something with 5 loops or something, so that it goes like this.

Guitar
Volume
TU2 (or in the volume or loooper's tuner out)
Wah
Loooper
Loop 1 - Whammy
Loop 2 - OD
Loop 3 - Dist
Loop 4 - Phase
Loop 5 - Roto
TR2
Delay

This would allow you to have less in the signal chain, and the board would be easier to manage.

Or you could have it like this-

Guitar
Volume
TU2 (or in the volume or loooper's tuner out)
Wah
Loooper 1
Loop 1 - Whammy
Loop 2 - OD
Loop 3 - Dist
Loooper 2
Loop 1 - Phase
Loop 2 - Roto
Loop 3 - Trem
Delay

This would allow you to split up your mods and the OD, dist and whammy...making the board easier to think about...then again, i don't know if you can have more than one effect at once on the looopers, so you may not be able to have (say) the whammy, OD and phase...

If this were all up to me, however, i would put it like this-

Guitar
TU2
Wah
Single loooper with whammy in it
Volume (with TU2 in tuner out) (this would allow you to control the strength of the OD or dist.)
OD
Dist.
Amp
FX send
Phase
Roto
Trem
Delay
FX return

But i don't know if you amp has an FX loop...

Sorry for this being so long, but it's a couple of suggestions...

DuoSonicII · #3 06.14.05, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jelly
Whereabouts in the chain is the loooper going to go? You would probably do best to have it near the start if you want the whammy in it...but as you say, you will need to experiment to see where it can track well enough.

Sorry if the main message got lost in all of the verbage, let me clarify. My idea was to have the following signal path:
TU2 > Vol > Wah > OD > Dist > Loooper > Delay
Everything else (Pitchshift, Phase, Trem, Rotary/Vibe, possible 2nd Delay) would go in the bypass loop, with the Whammy first in the loop and the rest of the order to be determined later.

And no, my amp doesn't have an effects loop, none of the Fender reissues do so that is unfortunately not an option.

Quote:

Originally posted by Jelly
If this were all up to me, however, i would put it like this-

Guitar
TU2
Wah
Single loooper with whammy in it
Volume (with TU2 in tuner out) (this would allow you to control the strength of the OD or dist.)
OD
Dist.
Amp
FX send
Phase
Roto
Trem
Delay
FX return

But i don't know if you amp has an FX loop...

Sorry for this being so long, but it's a couple of suggestions...

I'm not really big on the idea of having one of those super-huge Looopers with one loop for each pedal or whatever, just personal preference. I just wanted a simple one-looper to be able to remove the less-used effects from the chain most of the time, and I definitely don't want volume, wah, OD, and distortion in a loop - that is the main, direct part of my chain. I guess my main debate for the time being is whether I should go:

TU2 > Vol > Wah > OD > Dist > Loooper > Delay (in order to have buffered bypass pedals first and last)
or
Vol > Wah > OD > Dist > Loooper with the TU2 in the tuner out and the delay in the Loooper (to keep all buffered bypass pedals out of the main chain, though this could cause level problems when switching on the Loooper and/or problems with the guitar and volume pedal being in series).

And the secondary debate would be whether the Whammy is OK to put in the Loooper, or if it needs to be further up in the chain with its own mini-Loooper (I had considered that at one point in time). That would make it look a lot like your last suggestion. Ultimately though, this problem should be solved if I get a true-bypass Octron, which I would probably put first in the main chain.

Thanks for the advice, keep the suggestions coming!

DuoSonicII · #4 06.14.05, 4:03 PM

Update: just scored a Boss DD-20 on eBay this afternoon! Got it complete with the separate FS-5U footswitch for tap tempo, all for $155 + shipping. One of the last pieces falls into place, I'm pretty stoked.

So coincidentally, I have a Boss DD-3 and a Crybaby GCB-95 I'm ready to part with, drop me a line if you're interested.

DuoSonicII · #5 06.15.05, 9:54 AM

Wow, almost 100 page views and only one reply.

The lackluster response to this thread has gotten me motivated enough to finally get some pictures of my gear up on the net, starting with my axes:

DuoSonicII's Gear

In my album you will find pics of my '65 Duo-Sonic II, my heavily modified '66 Musicmaster II, my CIJ Jazzmaster, my 50's TrueTone (Kay) hollowbody and my 70's Ovation Viper. Photos of my G&L ASAT and my acoustic, plus other gear, should be forthcoming.

Let me know what you think!

no_happy · #6 06.16.05, 3:52 AM

some very nice guitars and it looks like it will turn into a very nice rig..

the only thing i can suggest is to experiment as much as is possible... and youll everntually find the combination you like

DuoSonicII · #7 06.16.05, 5:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by no_happy
some very nice guitars and it looks like it will turn into a very nice rig..

the only thing i can suggest is to experiment as much as is possible... and youll everntually find the combination you like

Thanks, and you're right. I think I have things pretty much figured out, beyond that I'll just have to do trial-and-error. I think most likely the Whammy will go first in the bypass loop, tracking be damned, and hopefully be replaced shortly thereafter with an Octron (if and when Fox starts moving them). As for the buffered bypass to start and end the chain, I've never gotten a solid answer no matter how much forum search I've done. Maybe that's because, as in many things, there is no right answer.

DuoSonicII · #8 09.01.05, 10:51 AM

I've been working on pedal order and arrangement with the intent of building a board shortly - thought I'd update the thread since I now have a pic of my potential setup:

Pedal Pic @ Webshots

The order is like this: Guitar > TU-2 > Octron > Volume > V848 Wah > Full-Drive 2 > Hot British > Micro-Loooper > DD-20

The other pedals (French Toast, TR-2, Chicken Salad, Small Stone) will be in the "loop" of the Loooper to remove them from the signal chain most of the time, and I'm not sure yet what order they will be in (I'll have to experiment). The TR-2 and Chicken Salad also might end up being replaced by some other trem/vibe/rotary-type craziness. I might end up putting the DD-20 in the loop too. And I just realized that I have the Hot British and the Full-Drive 2 backwards in the pic (I set it up at like 1:30 AM - go figure).

I still plan on getting a Voodoo Labs Pedal Power 2 Plus to power it all, and I think I might add a Dano Fish & Chips EQ in the loop too.

Pedals currently on the sideline:
Digitech Whammy (reissue)
Marshall Shredmaster
ProCo Rat2 (a good one with the LM308)
Dano Rocky Road
Dano PB&J delay
Boss DS-1 (strongly considering getting it modded by Analogman)
Boss DD-3 (trying to sell)
E-H Big Muff NYC

I would love to field any questions/comments/suggestions. Drop me a line!

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