Go Back   GeekChat! > SONGWRITING > Verse-Chorus-Verse

Reply

Share/Bookmark

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01.07.05, 11:10 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 234
DWMC is an unknown quantity at this point
Songs that don't rhyme

I don't understand how these are written. Do these people just write things down and slap in a chorus.
__________________
How many chords does it take to make a punk song?

Rig:
Splatter Stratocaster (MIM)>Boss TU-80>Dunlop Crybaby>Peavey Classic 50 212

To Be Added Sometime Later:

Seagul S6
Mesa Boogie F-30
Reply With Quote


  #2  
Old 01.11.05, 2:17 PM
Dan the Man's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Redding CA
Posts: 2,843
Dan the Man is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to Dan the Man
No. They make it as if it's going to rhyme and then remove the rhyming parts. I've never liked a song that doesn't rhyme if you can tell they didn't do it that way.
__________________
Quote:
Originally posted by Talent?!
Definately Dan the Legend.
Quote:
Originally posted by CicadaSilence
Atreyu makes me want to kill myself. But if I did that, I'd fall into their target demographic.

You can see my dilemma.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01.16.05, 2:59 AM
Amsterdarn's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 443
Amsterdarn is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to Amsterdarn
Non-rhyming songs are harder to make, but when properly done, they can be brilliant.

Case in point, Guster's "Demons"- this was, at one point, my favorite song. If you don't have a predjudice about pop music, then check it out. If you do, stop listening to Clear Channel, get your head straight, then go check it out. The lyrics:

My words confuse you,
My eyes don't move or blink,
'Cause it's easier sometimes not to be sincere,
Somehow I make you believe,

[chorus]
When I speak I cross my fingers,
Will you know you've been decieved?
I find a need to be the demon,
A demon cannot be hurt.

Honest is easy,
Fiction's where genius lies,
'Cause it's easier sometimes not to be involved
Somehow I make you believe,

[Chorus]

...It was years before I actually noticed the lack of rhymes- the lyrics just work.
__________________
Member of the Grammar Nazis.

Tele

French Toast > Milk Box > Bad Monkey > DD-20

Blues Junior

http://www.purevolume.com/alexbirdsall
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01.16.05, 11:01 AM
skip tracer's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 2,065
skip tracer is an unknown quantity at this point
I think it's harder to write songs that rhyme than songs that don't rhyme. Just write down what you want to say and put it to a melody. I tend to notice lyrics that are forced into a rhyme scheme than lyrics that aren't. Use meter, internal rhyme, and alliteration in place of rhymes at the end of every line.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01.17.05, 9:47 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 31
ForTheBones is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to ForTheBones
the excellent songwriters out there who use prose, instead of ryhmes in their songs, are very talented because they understand the language components, and how it works with the rythmn and meter of their songs, and how to treat their voices like instruments. the ones that have the truly great sounding lyrics and song dont just throw down random words. theyre chosen as to how they sound with the music.. not only this, but how the vocals are presented is important if you use prose more often then rhymes. those who stress a lot more on their vocal range, and spread it out can lose the effect of a words syllables, because the word is less spoken, and sung more. you've got to keep in mind, the vocals are like another instrument in the band, and you're playing notes with your throat. A ochestra choir most of the time sings only with their range and they dont use words at all. With those vocalists, they do treat their voices just like instruments.

rhyming only helps if you're trying to write something very catchy.
Lou Reed wrote a lot of his songs in the Sing-speak style where he is speaking more then singing, Rhyming was extremely important to him because of this.

So, its depends a lot on your singing style too.
__________________
something terrible beautiful.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01.17.05, 9:57 PM
hot_rats!'s Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: richmond, virginia
Posts: 2,381
hot_rats! is on a distinguished road
Send a message via AIM to hot_rats!
Quote:
Originally posted by skip tracer
I think it's harder to write songs that rhyme than songs that don't rhyme. Just write down what you want to say and put it to a melody. I tend to notice lyrics that are forced into a rhyme scheme than lyrics that aren't. Use meter, internal rhyme, and alliteration in place of rhymes at the end of every line.
sonic youth's song "skip tracer" is a good example of nonrhyming lyric.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01.22.05, 12:59 PM
nyrkickazz1's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York City
Posts: 5,879
nyrkickazz1 is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to nyrkickazz1
Many, many Radiohead songs have no rhyme whatsoever.
__________________
Quote:
"Rickenbackers make you think in melodies rather than blues scales." - Roger McGuinn
My stuff.
Rickenbacker 4003/4001 conversion project.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01.22.05, 1:24 PM
JDogg's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Greater London, UK
Posts: 3,285
JDogg is an unknown quantity at this point
Very few of my songs rhyme.

When your rhyming, often you end up looking for words to say that rhyme, rather than syaing what you mean.

I never really thought about it, just wrote songs and they don't rhyme.
__________________
So I'll try not to breathe as I hold my head still,
the light bends on my face, there'd be tears if I cried
And I'll try not to think what the happy things were
I just think of the stuff that just made me **** scared


Gear Pics!
Rig Thread
Elita's Rev Online

FOR SALE/TRADE:

Vox Valvetone - £45 posted or trade for Voodoo Labs Sparkle Drive

Digitech Digidelay (+cash) - trade for Boss DD-20
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01.25.05, 1:20 PM
Amsterdarn's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 443
Amsterdarn is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to Amsterdarn
Quote:
Originally posted by JDogg
I never really thought about it, just wrote songs
This is my main problem with music today.

(Don't take this as a slam on JDogg, I took that out of context to make a point about music at large.)
__________________
Member of the Grammar Nazis.

Tele

French Toast > Milk Box > Bad Monkey > DD-20

Blues Junior

http://www.purevolume.com/alexbirdsall
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01.25.05, 2:55 PM
JDogg's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Greater London, UK
Posts: 3,285
JDogg is an unknown quantity at this point
Quote:
Originally posted by Amsterdarn
This is my main problem with music today.

(Don't take this as a slam on JDogg, I took that out of context to make a point about music at large.)
Not taking offence.

I just don't understand what you mean....

When I said I 'didn't think about it' what I meant was I didn't think 'I've got to make this rhyme', I just let it flow rather than trying to force rhyme.

What's wrong with that in your opinion?
__________________
So I'll try not to breathe as I hold my head still,
the light bends on my face, there'd be tears if I cried
And I'll try not to think what the happy things were
I just think of the stuff that just made me **** scared


Gear Pics!
Rig Thread
Elita's Rev Online

FOR SALE/TRADE:

Vox Valvetone - £45 posted or trade for Voodoo Labs Sparkle Drive

Digitech Digidelay (+cash) - trade for Boss DD-20
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01.25.05, 3:18 PM
garyfanclub's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Charlottesville, VA
Posts: 533
garyfanclub is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to garyfanclub
If you can express your emotion without rhyming, then why even bother trying to rhyme. Rhyme is pointless and sometimes just comes off as cliche and annoying. It's important w/ pop songs for 14 year olds to memorize but seriously...
__________________
amplified amplification amplifier
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01.25.05, 4:21 PM
thegaz's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Indiana/New Mexico/Illinois
Posts: 297
thegaz is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to thegaz
Quote:
Originally posted by ForTheBones
the excellent songwriters out there who use prose, instead of ryhmes in their songs, are very talented because they understand the language components, and how it works with the rythmn and meter of their songs, and how to treat their voices like instruments. the ones that have the truly great sounding lyrics and song dont just throw down random words. theyre chosen as to how they sound with the music.
But Bob Dylan is considered one of the greatest songwriters ever, and some of his ryhmes sound so forced they are almost funny.
__________________
for sale:
check my fs post:
http://guitargeek.com/chat/showthread.php?s=&threadid=69753

mesa f-50 combo, $800 shipped
fostex MR8 digital 8 track recorder, $175 shipped
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02.23.05, 5:47 AM
Red_Fred's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Auckland, NZ
Posts: 144
Red_Fred is an unknown quantity at this point
I find rhyme is usually really cheesy and cliche. I listen to punk music and alot of the bands don't have rhmyming lyrics. I really don't see the problem infact I prefer non-rhyming. The lyrics are much stronger.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02.24.05, 12:06 AM
Amsterdarn's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 443
Amsterdarn is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via AIM to Amsterdarn
Quote:
Originally posted by JDogg
Not taking offence.

I just don't understand what you mean....

When I said I 'didn't think about it' what I meant was I didn't think 'I've got to make this rhyme', I just let it flow rather than trying to force rhyme.

What's wrong with that in your opinion?
Woo, reply a month late!

Okay, what I meant was that "I didn't really think about it, I just wrote songs," taken out of context, was a main problem of mine. In context, it's a perfectly reasonable thing- if rhyme is getting in the way of a good song, then by all means, get rid of it. I was intentionally misinterpreting you to make a point about songs with no thought in them at all- songs where the lyrics have no meaning behind them, it's just something to sing. Like Nickelback. I probably should have made that more clear.
__________________
Member of the Grammar Nazis.

Tele

French Toast > Milk Box > Bad Monkey > DD-20

Blues Junior

http://www.purevolume.com/alexbirdsall
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02.24.05, 5:47 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 92
Professor SourT is an unknown quantity at this point
It can depend if you write lyrics or music first. If you write music first, and wait for the lyrics to suggest themselves, they tend to find their own "fit" with relation to the music and the melody, not with each other. Also, if you have a scrap of a lyric saved up, it just might find a place to slot in by itself. Rhymes then are incidental, may happen or not.

Writing full lyrics ahead of time is where you have to watch the cliche - or do the Dylan thing and ride it till it submits!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 4:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014 | Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO
©1993 - 2014 GuitarGeek | All Rights Reserved